Quiver Season 4: Episode 20

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Amanda and Mike are back with an all-new episode of Quiver: The Green Arrow Podcast to recap the CW Arrow episode, “Genesis!” Can Oliver learn how to combat Darhk’s magic? Can Diggle stop his brother from causing more chaos? Can Thea escape from Pleasantville? Can we actually find something to enjoy in this episode!?! All these questions and more will be answered on this week’s all-new Quiver: The Green Arrow Podcast!


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1 Comment

  1. I love the Quiver podcast. I started listening to you shortly after I discovered Arrow during season two, and I’ve enjoyed hearing your thoughtful discussions – even through this difficult season where we’re all grappling with the show’s direction.

    Having just caught up on my show watching and podcast listening after two weeks abroad for work, I felt compelled to write after hearing your podcast for episode 20. I agree that Arrow has struggled this year to find storytelling rhythms that make sense, especially around the Big Bad. I appreciate that you both approach the show with critical thinking and honesty, calling out where it can improve. Yet, hearing the episode 20 show, I think you’ve crossed the line into allowing your frustrations to overtake your critical thinking.

    You spent 10-15 minutes discussing how Arrow had “lost the thread” in the Diggle storyline from this recent episode – that Andy’s death was meaningless and that Oliver was flip-flopping between preventing Ruve’s death last week and not challenging John after Andy’s death this week. I disagree with that take.

    Character deaths purely for their own sake are overdone on TV – you’re both right about that. But when we consider Andy’s death, we must consider it through the lens of John Diggle’s character, not Andy’s. From day one of this series, Diggle has been a moral grounding point for Oliver and team Arrow. He was the first to challenge Oliver around his methods, to encourage him to find something to live for, rather than simply seeking revenge (episode 1×04). One year ago, Diggle held Oliver to a higher standard when Oliver kidnapped Lyla and abandoned baby Sara to prove his darkness to the League, even when the women of Arrow were willing to let him slide a bit in the name of “acts of war.”

    Diggle had an unarmed Andy at gun point. Andy’s only threats to Diggle were verbal and very similar to those put forward by Slade Wilson towards Oliver – to always seek to destroy his family and those he loves. Yet rather than take Andy into custody and imprison him on Lian Yu or over at STAR Labs, Diggle took the darker path and killed his brother. The impact here is not the death itself; it’s that a character who was a light to Oliver and team Arrow has now stepped into the darkness. This isn’t the behavior we look for in fully realized heroes.

    Oliver gets there too late to stop Diggle. Has he reversed his position from the previous episode, where he stopped Diggle from killing Ruve Adams because “it’s not what we do?” No, of course not. But how could Oliver – who started his work in Starling City by snapping a guy’s neck just for seeing his abilities – lecture Diggle in that moment? In fact, Oliver is probably one of the few people who can fully empathize with Diggle’s position. He treated Diggle with compassion in an extremely charged situation. That’s not the same as endorsing the action itself.

    Please keep making this podcast and bringing your passion to us. It’s fun to hear your thoughts each week and feel part of this community. We all have to be careful, though, that we don’t get so lost in frustration with a few weak areas that we get blinded to the good aspects of this show. I hope that the writers hear what we’re all sharing about the current season and find ways to elevate their game next year.